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Thread: [musketeermail] Working and Dreaming

  1. #1

    [musketeermail] Working and Dreaming

    I'm assuming that you have considered buying one of the very nice-sounding
    C24R Sierras that have recently been offered?



    Of course, if you just can't be happy until you have has the Bo experience
    in your life, and you have the money to burn, then "why not". It is widely
    held that the "good Bo's" began with the 1969 V35A. The 1969 and later had
    fewer airframe and engine issues, and better performance.



    Contrary to popular belief, the Bo's went through many, many changes during
    their production life, to address a myriad of issues. There are Bonanzas,
    and there are Bonanzas. And having said that, if you can be happy with a
    straight-tail (Model 33), rather than the V-tail (Model 35), you'll be much
    happier with its utility and safety. Any of them worth buying is probably
    going to cost you somewhere north of $140,000.







    _____

    From: musketeermail@yahoogroups.com [mailto:musketeermail@yahoogroups.com]
    On Behalf Of davidweb
    Sent: Tuesday, October 18, 2005 7:24 AM
    To: musketeermail@yahoogroups.com
    Subject: [musketeermail] Working and Dreaming



    Hey Guys:

    Life as an insurance adjuster since Katrina has been all work and very
    little play (flying).

    I have been dreaming again about buying and owning a V35 Bonanza. I
    know the cost to maintain will be alot more than my Musketeer but my
    dream will not go away. I guess I am looking for positive comments to
    encourage me to follow that dream.

    If I do decide to buy the Bonanza, I will be selling my 64 A23.
    Problems with engine parts are not an issue with 8796M as I have a
    complete 2nd engine with 4 newly OH cylinders.

    Comments??

    David



    _____

    _______________________________________________
    BAC-Mail mailing list
    BAC-Mail@beechaeroclub.org
    http://www.beechaeroclub.org/mailman/listinfo/bac-mail

  2. #2
    From Steve Robertson on MML:

    From: musketeermail@yahoogroups.com [mailto:musketeermail@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ke4oh
    Sent: Tuesday, October 18, 2005 8:51 AM
    To: musketeermail@yahoogroups.com
    Subject: [musketeermail] Re: Working and Dreaming

    I used to be partners in a 1952 C-model Bonanza. I wish I had bought
    it when our partnership split up. As Mike R. said, the line went
    through many changes over the years. So, just saying you're looking
    for a V-tail doesn't convey enough info to give you specific good
    advice. Because of the evolution, my comments below don't all apply
    to all models.

    The newest ones, V35B, will be quite a chunk of change, as will the
    Debonairs (model 33 with the conventional tail). The older V-tails
    from the 40s and 50s are the cheapest to buy, but are the most
    problematic. Some particular year (1956?), Beech switched from the E-
    series Continental engines to the O-470. There is a price jump at
    that point due to the "modern" engine.

    Here is my take:

    Pros:
    1. Very fast for the horsepower and fuel burn.
    2. Built like a tank. Beech quality and class.
    3. Roomy, at least in the front seat.
    4. EASIEST to fly plane I've ever been in, and I've flown a lot of
    them. Delightful feel on the controls. Never needs rudder.
    5. Terrific short field performance.
    6. Pretty dang good soft field performance. Robust landing gear.
    7. Fairly good engine access with the Ford Model-A style cowl.
    8. Reliable retract system.
    9. Excellent outside visibility due to the nose-down attitude in
    cruise (similar to Musketeer).
    10. Many still have electric constant-speed prop. No ADs on the prop
    and it works real nice if you have one of the aftermarket electronic
    controllers.
    11. Big 6-cyl Continental is easy to start (good thing 'cause there's
    no primer) and runs smooth.
    12. Early models have a real nice pressure carburetor setup that is
    sort of like poor-mans fuel injection. No carb heat or carb ice
    worries.

    Cons:
    1. Hopelessly bad instrument panel design. An upgrade to a modern
    panel is a big plus. Original "piano key" swithes are desgined
    specifically to make it easier to land gear up!!!
    2. Magnesium control surfaces. If they haven't been reskinned yet,
    they need to be.
    3. You will cruise way up in the yellow arc most of the time,
    especially on the older ones. Does that make you nervous?
    4. V-tail falls off. Or not. Whom do you believe?
    5. Weird combination manual wobble pump/fuel tank selector. Use one
    hand to pump up fuel pressue, other hand to push starter button,
    third hand to work the throttle.
    6. Single fuel guage for multiple tanks. Two different switches on
    the panel to select which tank the guage is reading. This is just bad.
    7. Center of gravity moves to the rear as fuel is burned, just like
    Musketeer line. However, Bones are way tail-heavy vs. Musketeer way
    nose heavy. It's really easy in a Bone to take off in the envelope
    and land tail heavy.
    8. Bladder fuel tanks. I don't like 'em.
    9. Hard to find some parts for the E-series Continentals.
    10. They've ALL been landed gear up! Some more than once. Some many
    more times than once.
    11. Not really a bad problem, but it's hard to get a V-tail to slow
    down enough to lower the gear without going to idle power. Typically
    have to make a shallow climb before dropping gear.
    12. Need an A&P/IA who knows older Bonanza systems, how to fix them,
    and where to get parts. If you have the right A&P, maint costs won't
    be any worse than any other complex. If not, you are in for a series
    of expensive lessons.
    13. Back seat passengers will need strong stomach in all but the
    lightest turbulance. Lots of yaw oscillation.

    Can't fault your desire to have a Bone. There is no substitute. Just
    go into it with your eyes open and one hand on your wallet.

    Best regards,

    Steve Robertson
    N4732J 1967 Super III
    ex-N5839C 1952 C35

  3. #3
    From Bob Lewis on MML:

    From: musketeermail@yahoogroups.com [mailto:musketeermail@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Robert Lewis
    Sent: Tuesday, October 18, 2005 2:00 PM
    To: davidweb; musketeermail@yahoogroups.com
    Subject: Re: [musketeermail] Working and Dreaming

    Hi Dave, I was also looking at a Bonanza. I joined and
    I'm still a member of ABS. I've read every publication
    on the Bo and I looked at my flying missions to
    determine the logic of going from 700 a year for
    insurance to 1800 per year. I have friends with
    Bonanzas so I assisted in the annuals and the least
    expensive has been 3k and the most 55K, over hauled
    engine and prop. I noted that even with the E-225
    engine, the 1956 has the least AD's and parts other
    than prop components are readily available. The skin
    thickness was increased as time went on and some of
    the Early Bonanzas require a skin thickness test and
    some a 3k rear bulkhead inspection (and if it needs
    replaced it is 8k). The stc holder lives in the
    midwest and if you don't, you need to fly and pay for
    his expenses to come to your area. Each Bonanza has
    specific areas of concern. If you decide to purchase
    one, ABS has an excellent prepurchase download to use.
    I suggest you hire a BEECH BONANZA specific mechanic
    with LOTS of experience to help you. I have seen great
    looking planes with bad bathtub fittings and
    ruddervators with excessive corrosion and too much
    paint causing a potential balance problems. Prior to
    buying my musketeer, I flew to the LA area to look at
    a Bonanza that had been maintained and was being sold
    by a Wellll Known Bonanza repair station. I told them
    what I was looking for and they assured me this
    Bonanza fit my criteria. Within 10 minutes of my
    arrival, I found excessive corrosion on the
    ruddervators and loose top bearings, a misaligned flap
    that would not seat properly and the new engine and
    prop were installed using old mounts and the engine
    compartment was not even cleaned. The interior has
    moisture dripping from the instruments even though it
    was advertised as always hangared. I would suggest you
    do what I did and attend an ABS clinic and see the
    immediate items to look for to help narrow you scope.
    If most of your flights are 350 miles or less,
    remember, the difference in speed vs cost. The Bonanza
    will arrive 15 to 20 minutes sooner for nearly three
    times the insurance cost and three plus on the cost
    for an annual. Don't forget that the big contenential
    engines usually need topped at 500 hours. The cost for
    this is nearly the cost of a rebuild on an
    0-320/0-360. I paid 10K to overhaul my 0-320 with new
    cylinders, cam and accessories. My buddy paid 8K to
    top his e-225. Good luck on your decision. What ever
    you do, join ABS and speak with their tech guys on any
    Bonanza model you focus on. They, like our tech guys
    are very knowledgeable and will save you money.-Bob L

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