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Thread: IFR Panel

  1. #1

    IFR Panel

    Hello Musketeers,
    Iam looking into doing some IFR training, My airplane has a King nav with a glideslope. My issue is with my panel arrangment. It has its basic six pack except that the climb/decent indicator has been moved and a VOR indicator without glidescope.has been put in its place., all of the avionics are in the center and the VOR indicator with the Glidescope is in front of the co pilot. I really dont want to move the avionics from were they are now, .
    NOTE: the vor is where I would like to put the Glideslope Indicator. Is it OK to leave the Rate of climb/decent indicator where it is and just change the VOR?
    ATTACHED is a photo of my panel.


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  2. #2
    Guest
    Guest

    IFR Panel

    Trae,


    I didn't see the picture. It may have been stripped off.

    Anyway, It sort of depends on what other equipment is in your panel.
    Swapping the VORs solves only one problem. Identifying intersections,
    holding at intersections, etc. can still be a pain in the butt with one
    VOR way over on the other side of the panel. Moving the VSI won't help
    you either. It needs to be in view to help you keep your altitude well
    under control. It is part of your scan.

    Personally, I'd look for the option that gets your six pack in front of
    you along with your VOR needles.

    I went through something similar on my panel not to long ago. If you
    send a pic to my email, I'll be happy to take a look and make a
    suggestion.


    Regards,


    RJF





    On Wed, 2006-08-30 at 16:59 -0700, Trae McElwaney wrote:
    > Hello Musketeers,
    > Iam looking into doing some IFR training, My airplane has a King nav
    > with a glideslope. My issue is with my panel arrangment. It has its
    > basic six pack except that the climb/decent indicator has been moved
    > and a VOR indicator without glidescope.has been put in its place., all
    > of the avionics are in the center and the VOR indicator with the
    > Glidescope is in front of the co pilot. I really dont want to move the
    > avionics from were they are now, .
    > NOTE: the vor is where I would like to put the Glideslope Indicator.
    > Is it OK to leave the Rate of climb/decent indicator where it is and
    > just change the VOR?
    > ATTACHED is a photo of my panel.
    >
    >
    > ---------------------------------
    > Want to be your own boss? Learn how on Yahoo! Small Business.
    >
    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >



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  3. #3

    IFR Panel

    Trae:

    By all means swap the instruments around so you have the scan YOU
    want. I thought about having my indicators just above the radios so
    it would be a quick scan to the top of the stack.

    Then I flew in a King Air as a passsenger with a professional pilot
    and had an epiphany.

    If you can afford one, I really (I mean REALLY) recommend that you
    put in an HSI in the DG spot. It really makes the scan so much
    easier it's almost cheating. Put in your primary VOR/GS input into
    the HSI and you'll NEVER want to fly IFR without one.

    You also need a good Attitude indicator that as a scale in degrees so
    you'll know if your pitch is flat, up, or down AND by how much. The
    old AN horizon isn't good enough.

    Autopilots are nice but PRECISION instruments make the job SOOOOO
    much easier.




    --- In musketeermail@yahoogroups.com, Trae McElwaney <gaboytm@...>
    wrote:
    >
    > Hello Musketeers,
    > Iam looking into doing some IFR training, My airplane has a
    King nav with a glideslope. My issue is with my panel arrangment. It
    has its basic six pack except that the climb/decent indicator has
    been moved and a VOR indicator without glidescope.has been put in its
    place., all of the avionics are in the center and the VOR indicator
    with the Glidescope is in front of the co pilot. I really dont want
    to move the avionics from were they are now, .
    > NOTE: the vor is where I would like to put the Glideslope
    Indicator. Is it OK to leave the Rate of climb/decent indicator where
    it is and just change the VOR?
    > ATTACHED is a photo of my panel.
    >
    >
    > ---------------------------------
    > Want to be your own boss? Learn how on Yahoo! Small Business.
    >
    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    >






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    www.beechaeroclub.org


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  4. #4

    IFR Panel

    Agree with the HSI suggestion. The only issue is
    MONEY... and if that is not an issue I would seriously
    go with an all electric version, slaved of course.
    Will get you close to 10K dollars installed and
    certified. But... yep that is the way to go.
    An alternative is to RENT a plane that has all this
    stuff and learn to fly the HSI and get your IFR ticket
    that way...
    Unfortunately having an HSI or not seems to make very
    little difference when you are getting ready to sell.
    ie it's not a good investment from that perspective.
    Consider an alternative to buy for the same amount of
    money a Garmin stack with large moving map and you
    will have additional capabilities in ALL weather. It's
    not totally the same but hey I like my KMD 150 with
    King 89B certified and coupled to my STEC 50
    autopilot. See my panel pictures on
    www.myplaneonline.com
    Cheers
    Harry Roussard
    Sierra 1975 MC 360

    --- ajpcps <ajpcps@yahoo.com> wrote:

    > Trae:
    >
    > By all means swap the instruments around so you have
    > the scan YOU
    > want. I thought about having my indicators just
    > above the radios so
    > it would be a quick scan to the top of the stack.
    >
    > Then I flew in a King Air as a passsenger with a
    > professional pilot
    > and had an epiphany.
    >
    > If you can afford one, I really (I mean REALLY)
    > recommend that you
    > put in an HSI in the DG spot. It really makes the
    > scan so much
    > easier it's almost cheating. Put in your primary
    > VOR/GS input into
    > the HSI and you'll NEVER want to fly IFR without
    > one.
    >
    > You also need a good Attitude indicator that as a
    > scale in degrees so
    > you'll know if your pitch is flat, up, or down AND
    > by how much. The
    > old AN horizon isn't good enough.
    >
    > Autopilots are nice but PRECISION instruments make
    > the job SOOOOO
    > much easier.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > --- In musketeermail@yahoogroups.com, Trae McElwaney
    > <gaboytm@...>
    > wrote:
    > >
    > > Hello Musketeers,
    > > Iam looking into doing some IFR training, My
    > airplane has a
    > King nav with a glideslope. My issue is with my
    > panel arrangment. It
    > has its basic six pack except that the climb/decent
    > indicator has
    > been moved and a VOR indicator without
    > glidescope.has been put in its
    > place., all of the avionics are in the center and
    > the VOR indicator
    > with the Glidescope is in front of the co pilot. I
    > really dont want
    > to move the avionics from were they are now, .
    > > NOTE: the vor is where I would like to put
    > the Glideslope
    > Indicator. Is it OK to leave the Rate of
    > climb/decent indicator where
    > it is and just change the VOR?
    > > ATTACHED is a photo of my panel.
    > >
    > >
    > > ---------------------------------
    > > Want to be your own boss? Learn how on Yahoo!
    > Small Business.
    > >
    > > [Non-text portions of this message have been
    > removed]
    > >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >


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  5. #5

    IFR Panel

    --- In musketeermail@yahoogroups.com, Harry Roussard <hroussar@...>
    wrote:
    >
    > Agree with the HSI suggestion. The only issue is
    > MONEY... and if that is not an issue I would seriously
    > go with an all electric version, slaved of course.
    > Will get you close to 10K dollars installed and
    > certified.

    *** Personally, if I had 10K to spend, I'd get a modern approach
    certified, color moving map GPS, like a GNS430. Well, that's actually
    what I did. I shuffled the original radio stack so the GNS430 is
    fairly high in the panel. I kept all the original avionics except for
    NAVCOM1 - a KX170B, which the GNS430 replaced. So I now have two
    navs with glideslope, the GPS, two COMs, a DME, an ADF, and a
    Northstar M1 Loran.

    The HSI is essentially a mechanical moving map. It shows not only
    whether you're on the radial, but also your angle relative to the
    radial. A moving-map GPS can do the same thing - when you're on
    course or parallel to the course, the little airplane on the map is
    aligned with the course.

    And the GPS depiction of the little airplane is GROUND TRACK, which
    means that you don't have to worry about wind correction.

    I have even started using mine during ILS approaches - the GPS
    shows what heading I should be flying ( DTK or "desired track") and
    what heading I AM flying (TRK or "track" ). So I just center the
    needle, turn the airplane until TRK=DTK, note the number on the DG,
    and just ride'er down the chute with the DG set to that number. If
    the needle starts to move again, the wind has changed, and I do it
    again.

    Of course, an HSI in addition to the moving map GPS would be neat,
    but there's that money thing again....

    - Jerry Kaidor












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  6. #6

    IFR Panel

    Jerry, I agree and that's why I went with a King GPS
    and Moving Map and did not bother with the HSI.
    Very soon we all should have only GPS approachees and
    they are supposed to be very ... very simple

    Clearly ... if you have some more Money..why not going
    with the G1000 set up.... ARRHHHGGG this is that
    Money word again.

    Cheers

    HarryR

    --- jerrytr2com <jerry@tr2.com> wrote:

    > --- In musketeermail@yahoogroups.com, Harry Roussard
    > <hroussar@...>
    > wrote:
    > >
    > > Agree with the HSI suggestion. The only issue is
    > > MONEY... and if that is not an issue I would
    > seriously
    > > go with an all electric version, slaved of course.
    >
    > > Will get you close to 10K dollars installed and
    > > certified.
    >
    > *** Personally, if I had 10K to spend, I'd get a
    > modern approach
    > certified, color moving map GPS, like a GNS430.
    > Well, that's actually
    > what I did. I shuffled the original radio stack so
    > the GNS430 is
    > fairly high in the panel. I kept all the original
    > avionics except for
    > NAVCOM1 - a KX170B, which the GNS430 replaced. So I
    > now have two
    > navs with glideslope, the GPS, two COMs, a DME, an
    > ADF, and a
    > Northstar M1 Loran.
    >
    > The HSI is essentially a mechanical moving map.
    > It shows not only
    > whether you're on the radial, but also your angle
    > relative to the
    > radial. A moving-map GPS can do the same thing -
    > when you're on
    > course or parallel to the course, the little
    > airplane on the map is
    > aligned with the course.
    >
    > And the GPS depiction of the little airplane is
    > GROUND TRACK, which
    > means that you don't have to worry about wind
    > correction.
    >
    > I have even started using mine during ILS
    > approaches - the GPS
    > shows what heading I should be flying ( DTK or
    > "desired track") and
    > what heading I AM flying (TRK or "track" ). So I
    > just center the
    > needle, turn the airplane until TRK=DTK, note the
    > number on the DG,
    > and just ride'er down the chute with the DG set to
    > that number. If
    > the needle starts to move again, the wind has
    > changed, and I do it
    > again.
    >
    > Of course, an HSI in addition to the moving map
    > GPS would be neat,
    > but there's that money thing again....
    >
    > - Jerry Kaidor
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >


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